Friday, September 06, 2013

How the Inanity of Our Political Arguments Prove We're Doomed

Take the horse blinders off, take a step back and follow the ole Captain on this one, because I had to step back myself, wipe the crud from my eyes and see what was really going on.

I was thinking about global warming.  Not from a scientific or political perspective, but a psychological one.  Namely,

"How dumb are these people not to see it for the scam it is?"

Really?  Global warming?  Based on computer models that keep failing, constantly get proven wrong, from avowed socialist scientists, and (surprise, surprise) the only solution seems to be higher taxes and more government spending?

But it isn't even the arguments (scientific, political, economic, or logical) that gets me, as much as it is the pure inanity of the topic.  It's the fact I have to even debate this in the first place.  That there are millions of mindless, conforming humans that actually believe this stuff necessitating my expenditure of calories of energy to address the idiotic and very-religious-like premises of global warming.  In other words, the fact we're arguing about something so inane proves there is a larger underlying problem than global warming itself.

Another political issue I can't believe we're arguing - feminism.  Not that women should be treated equal and have the same rights as men, etc., but more the current frontier that feminism is pushing.  That men and women are INTERCHANGEABLE, and if they're not, THEN THEY BETTER DAMN SHOULD BE!

Ignore the differences in plumbing.
Ignore the differences we enjoy.
Ignore the different aptitudes and weaknesses of both and how they compliment each other and help society advance.

No men and women MUST BE interchangeable to the point we're going to bring them up "genderless."  And if you don't agree with that, then you're a (fill in misogynist term here)_______________!

Again, it's an inane argument.  No sane people should have to argue against it.  But its outlandishness is only outdone by the fact society is so mindless that this topic has even attained "debatability" in society. The only thing more outlandish is feminism's recent movement into "fact acceptance."

And finally, the never ending arguing I've had to deal with since roughly the age of 18.  Where, in a room of thousands of 20 and 30 somethings over scores of parties, I seem to be the sole mind of reason making the "outrageous" claim that you can't have a society where nobody works.  That people need to work to support themselves.  That we all can't be elementary school teachers and that the equally inane Keynesianism where we "just move money around and economic growth will magially happen" is bunk.  20 years it's been where I painfully have to stoop down to my adversaries' childish level and explain, be it at a college party, a house party, or just in the company of others, the very simple and adult concept that there's no such thing as a free lunch.  That if there are too many parasites and not enough producers, society will collapse.

And in return for my insistence on being the only mature adult in the room I get called every type of "ist" or every kind of condescending ideology (Nazi, Fascist, etc.).

But then something dawned on me, prompted by my increasing misanthropy and cynicism triggered by humans -

Do they really believe it?

For example, does the average impoverished black man really believe his poverty is caused by "whitey" and NOT the illegitimacy rate, the crime, lack of fathers and out of wedlock births in his community?

Does that social worker I'm arguing with REALLY believe we can just move money around, take it from those "evil rich" and all the country's socioloigical problems go away?

Does that environmental activist REALLY believe in global warming and care about the planet?

Or is it just one big-ass red-herring for the Right to chase, waste their efforts and energies debating, foolishly believing these people are dumb enough to believe it, when in reality it's just a front to obscure their ulterior motives of theft and parasitism?

And after thinking about it, I've realized it's both.

It is here, we need to break down the left into two general, but very applicable categories - categories I cannot claim to have come up with, but rather a reader - "Dupes" and "Devils."  Both of which populate the left, and both of which explain how these inane political arguments are both a ruse and a legitimate ideology members of the left believe.

The "Dupes" are your mindless, zombies who believe anything they're told.  They are the foot soldiers of the left.  They never think on their own, they have no critical thinking skills (despite what their professors tell them), they don't care to think through the consequences of their actions or ideology and largely can be persuaded with bumper sticker sound bytes or chants that "sound good to them."

Typically the Dupes are you high school or college students or celebrities.  Younger idiotic and wiseless children who, by society, the media, the education system, and the government, have been told they are oh-so-smart and "independent minded" as they all wear the same lame ass skinny jeans, thick rimmed glasses, and magically all have the EXACT same political ideology.  But don't think it's just youth or a lack of education.  You can have professors, fully indoctrinated into the system that their brain is no longer capable of independent thought.  A third generation union worker whose forefathers never let alternative ideas into the family.  Or even a politician, completely clueless about the mechanics of economics, governance and statesmanship, and just in politics because their grandaddy was.  Regardless of the age, economic or other sociological backgrounds, these people have NEVER thought their ideology through and mindlessly follow it like a radical Muslim or a born again Christian.  They not only have no intention of "finding the truth," they are fully incapable of it.  And thusly, because of the lack of a truly free mind, they make the perfect "dupe" for any politician willing to abuse them.

Those politicians willing to abuse them are the "Devils."  People who fully well know what they're advocating is not feasible, unsustainable, and sometimes just outright wrong and evil, but don't care, because it is for their own personal gain.

The liberal arts professors sucking the tuition-blood out of your child, crippling their financial futures until they're 60, as they charge $400 a credit for their worthless humanities class.

Jesse Jackson race-whoring, blaming all of one group's problems on other groups, permitting no critical thinking, self-inflection, let alone desire to actually help the group he hypocritical claims to be helping.

The limosuine liberal, who wants to avoid a real job at all costs and instead enters politics, advocating the unbeatable policy of taxing a rich minority to buy the votes and love of the middle class and poor majorities.  Never once would they ever part with their own money to help the poor, it is only through taking other's money do they advocate such a thing. 

Whichever of the many variants of Devils, when you're arguing with them, they know full well they are lying, they are living a lie, they are ruining millions of people's lives, and they don't care. They are the epitome of evil.

Now, regardless of whether you are facing a "Devil" or a "Dupe," libertarians, conservatives and other right sided folk face a problem when attempting to engage them in a debate - neither Devils nor Dupes are capable of being convinced.

First, the Dupes are incapable of being convinced because they, frankly, lack the intellectual capacity for intellectual honesty.  The lies they've been told are too kind to their egos and thinking of anything else would hurt their fragile little feelings.  They will live a lie and suffer the consequences because it's more important their ego be saved than their lives be enjoyed.

And second, the Devils are also incapable of being convinced, not because they need convincing, but because they already agree with you. They agree with everything you say.  Now get them to admit that and give up their racket.  They won't because the money is just too good.  And so good luck ever convincing a Devil.

So what's a righter-leaning person supposed to do?

Simple - deny their premise right off the bat.

You see, I don't know about you, but I got sick and tired of the 2 hour arguments at college parties where it would go around and around in circles where inevitably they would just say we'd have to agree to disagree.  Or where through some spectacularly concocted mental self-rationalizing bullshit, a leftist would say something inane like "well my perception is reality." Or "I don't believe your figures." (both true).

My life is too short for that.

Instead, a much better approach to debating a Dupe (or a Devil) is to immediately call them out on their bullshit.

To a Dupe you say, "you know what, I'm sorry, but I'm not going to debate you.  You aren't going to be convinced or persuaded because it's simple - you refuse to.  You prefer to believe in your ideology like an unfounded religion and no amount of data or empirical proof I have will convince you.  You want to believe a lie which is psychotic and there's nothing I can do to counteract a mental problem."

To a Devil you say, "You're a liar, and you know it.  You don't believe the BS you're spewing for one god damned second.  And you ain't fooling me."

This will not solve any debates.  This will not convince any one to agree with you.  But you have to realize one key important thing;

You were never going to solve the debate or convince any one in the first place.  It was doomed from the beginning.

But what you DO achieve in calling BS on the premise or calling them out on their intellectual dishonesty is is two things.

In terms of Dupes you DIRECTLY address their real problem - psychological delusion.  You say, "No, the real issue is not global warming or whether there are such things as genders, etc., it's that you have such an impaired mind that you actually think this is even debatable.  That you have such a psychological problem that I have to stand here and engage you with kid's gloves on actually thinking you believe it's big bad rich people who are holding the world down when in reality you just want an excuse to steal other people's money."  This moves the national political debate from arguments that are never going to be solved to arguments as to the sanity of the Dupes.

In terms of the Devils you  DIRECTLY address their real problem - they're sociopaths.  If there's one thing I love about calling the Devils out on their BS is that you actually do not look like a Dupe yourself.  I don't know how many years I've listened to talk radio hosts, WHO SHOULD KNOW BETTER, swallow whole the lies and the premise the Devil's put before them and then argue from such an impossible handicap.  The Devil's are LAUGHING their asses off at you.  There you go trying to explain, in THEIR TERMS, restricted to their premises, why global warming isn't real, why race relations are better than they claim, how the wage gap is BS, when your only argument should be "you're a liar and a charlatan and you can go to hell.  You're abusing the people you portend to be helping and you should be ashamed of yourself."

Of course most talk show hosts, pundits, and conservative media types never grow the balls to accuse leftist Devils of "crusaderism" or evil, which plays wonderfully into their hands as they make idiots of themselves vainly trying to convince them.  But perhaps someday, they might actually want to take the kiddie gloves off, dispense with the "my fine colleague from across the aisle" bullshit and start throwing down.


Aaron said...

Many on the right are devils and dupes as well - more of a flavor than a meaningful difference in substance. And as long as government is allowed to distribute property and favor via directed violence there will always be devils and aspiring devils.

Seth the Nocturnal Otter said...

Reminds me of this little speech:

Starting from roughly 1:00 into the clip.

Black Coffee said...

If I find someone relatively open minded to the subject of climatic change I send them to a couple sites that do an excellent job of debunking global warming. I am sure bote site have their critics but I find them very informative.

Anonymous said...

Very interesting. Wish I'd read it about 9 hours ago in the queue for the polling booth. Democracy in action! Vote!...or pay a $72 fine.

But it wasn't all bad. Someone in the queue got into a "fight" with a party volunteer (they hand out 'how to vote' cards, showing the party preference deals) over a stupid policy idea, and somehow raw sausages and onion were airborne. have an election, have a sausage sizzle. have an election, watch an argument.

Dan said...

Yep....pretty much.
Except around these parts
we like to call the Dupes
"useful idiots"

Anonymous said...

Ignorance, especially when aided by arrogance, all too often masquerades as a profound truth especially by those who do not take make an effort to understand fully their own and their opponents positions.

That ignorance is the scourge of societies everywhere and if not make an effort to understand our world then we will reap yet more turmoil, bloodshed or if we're lucky, merely a slow decline in our fortunes.

When it comes to understanding the danger, Charles Dickens said it best.

"They are Man’s," said the Spirit, looking down upon them. "And they cling to me, appealing from their fathers. This boy is Ignorance. This girl is Want. Beware them both, and all of their degree, but most of all beware this boy, for on his brow I see that written which is Doom, unless the writing be erased.

Anonymous said...

It's a matter of collective insanity. I think you are right and the evidence is there if you look at the fate of totalitarian regimes. Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union were cases of mass histeria. People learn to live within the system they are in. They know its wrong but the state is so powerful they go along to get along. Before East Germany collapsed they had a secret police force (STASI) of 250,000 odd people spying on there neighbours. The wall came down and they just walked away and got on with their lives. It is the Hive Mind that has to be defeated for people to be free. - Minuteman

Anonymous said...

Once again you are able to distill things in a way that everyone can understand. You are exactly right. About 90% of leftists (most people) are dupes. The devils easily manipulate them. I am amazed at this but it seems to be a common thread in the human condition. I read that when Stalin died people in the Soviet Gulag cried. Similarly when a woman was raped here in the TWin Cities by minorities she was quoted at being concerned with "social justice" and hoped that a "global solution" would be found.

Eric S. Mueller said...

One thing I've started doing (which is minor and probably amounts to trolling) comes up whenever somebody makes a comment like "there are too many people in the world. We need to get rid of some."

I've started replying "If you really believe that, why don't you set the example for us and go first?"

Despite the fact that Malthus was wrong, Ehrlich was wrong, every single leftist "population bomb" ego-centric non-accountable college professor was wrong, people still perpetuate this myth. I've started calling them on it because I'm tired of hearing it. I also don't believe that anybody who thinks himself qualified to decide which parts of the population don't deserve to continue existing should be making that decision.

sth_txs said...

Captain, both the libtards and conservatards are worthless and both parties are all of the problem. I do find libtards more sociopathic and hypocritical and oblivious to facts and logic, but even conservatards have their limits. I know you have addressed crusaderism on the left and right, but I don't have much regard for 'conservative' pundits. Rush Limbaugh is a fraud. Even Neil Boortz is not much of a libertarian.

I have yet to hear any conservative demand abolishing most of the federal government so these issues would mostly go away.

Some years ago, I would post what was billed as a 'slightly left of center blog'. The libtards there supposedly cared about the 4th Amendment except when it came to the government taking your guns or snooping through your financial records. They also believed the government really cared about them and that their SS benefits truly were adjusted for inflation. These are supposedly mature adults at that. It was pathetic to deal with them.

It was lost on them you can't tax a person making a low $40k's salary at 1/3 before and after the check and then wonder why their is no middle class, whatever that is these days.

Anonymous said...

There are many things wrong with your understanding of climate science, but I won't bother with that now.

I disagree with your premise that debating the dupes/devils is a complete waste of time. If you debate, others will likely listen, and if they have an inkling of intelligence they may begin to question the brainwashing they've been forced through. You may not convert your target, but onlookers will be more impressed.

SM777 said...

"First, the Dupes are incapable of being convinced because they, frankly, lack the intellectual capacity for intellectual honesty."
Must be something the elite puts in the water. Fluoride perhaps?

Anyway, I gave up trying to inform the Dupes. The fact is, maybe they don't want to face the upcoming reality.

They will have no choice but to wise up anyway, as they will be forced to remove the shoe out of their butts due to the Great American Asskicking which is just getting underway.

Ask the Russians/Ukranians about how much faith they have in the government vs. the free market. They learned the hard way. I used to know a Ukranian and he told me that literally everything coming out of a gov. bureaucrats' or politcians' mouth was a lie and he was born in the 1940's during the reign of stalin.

That's probably why, in spite of all of the corruption over there, most of that populace continue to engage each other in commerce (private business) and try to avoid their govs. at almost all costs.

Approx. 1/2 of my distant relatives live by the epitome of "'s the gov's. job to take care of me". When they announce that the welfare/nazi-security (S.S.)/"disabitlity" payments are going to end because the fedgov is out of funds, it will a new enlightenment. However, some of them will pay a heavy price for living in a willing state of delusion.

The Phantom said...

"So what's a righter-leaning person supposed to do?"

Just a reminder Captain, hippie punching is never wrong.

Glasgow kiss is another popular option.

Anonymous said...

I call them progtards and progholes.

Anonymous said...

There are many things wrong with your understanding of climate science, but I won't bother with that now.

Climate science is not a science at all. In science you put forth a theory and test it through experimentation and/or observation of natural events. If nature proves your theory wrong, you modify or discard it and move on.

Anthropogenic Global Warming theory was falsified in the late 90's by observations of how warming was progressing at different altitudes (it is consistent with the theory that nature is the cause).

Less technically, and more dramatically, AGW has again been falsified with global temperature observations of the past 15 years: the Earth stopped warming at a time when anthropogenic CO2 was higher then ever and growing faster then ever.

The climate modelers themselves have stated that if their projections were off over a 10 year period or longer, it would falsify the models. At the 10 year mark they changed their tune and said they really needed 15 years to see. We're now at the 15 year mark. How much you want to bet they will ask for more money and time?

AGW theory has been scientifically falsified. No one who continues to advocate or push it is engaged in science.

Anonymous said...

To Aaron:

Those calling themselves on the RIGHT only pretend they are. The wolves in sheepskin clothing are busy as well.

There are many examples in the so called Republican Party

Laguna Beach Fogey said...

Stop your whining, you capitalist pig.

We're not doomed.

On the contrary, this will be an age of awesome opportunities for men such as yourself.

And for chaps such as myself.

Seek order in disorder.

Find opportunity in chaos.

Dave said...

Argument does not cure delusion. Sometimes a severe shock will do it, but most people hold their delusions to the death. That can happen sooner than expected if you get killed by a predator that you insisted was harmless, or millions starve to death because the government really did run out of money to feed them.

Scientists are among the worst offenders in this regard. As Max Planck famously said, "Science progresses one funeral at a time."

Anonymous said...

Devils aren't sociopaths. They're narcissists. The sociopaths are their chief-of-staffs pulling their strings.

Anonymous said...

"There are many things wrong with your understanding of climate science, but I won't bother with that now."

Of course you won't! You're full of shit!

Donttreadonmatt said...

I agree with the comment that others may be watching/listening and you may be able to convince them when engaging in a debate with a devil or dupe.

I would debate a "friend" on Facebook, never able to convince him because he truly lacked critical thinking skills and was indeed a dupe. I received friend requests from many of his friends who were watching, who rarely engaged in the debate, but liked what I was saying.

That being said, you eventually harvest as many people as possible from such debates, and soon it kind of dries up. That's when you know it's time to move on. In any population, there are a certain percentage of people who are open to ideas and debate, and once captured there is nothing left, or it is so low that its no longer worth your time.

I imagine something similar happens to bloggers who eventually see their numbers plateau, and then decide to just quit. At some point, in everything, you're preaching to the choir.

Which ultimately leads to the final solution, which is to go Galt.

Anonymous said... <--everyone here should read this!

Pat said...

As well as the dupes, or perhaps as a subset of them, there are a large number who are going along to get along. If they see devils pontificating without any comeback they will carry on, reinforced in their view that they have picked the right side. There are also genuinely neutral people. If these are listening, or might be listening, it is worth kicking back, not to convince your opponent, that as you say is impossible, but to convince the neutral observer and place doubt in the go along to get along type.

Mazzuchelli said...

Dear "The Phantom":

Will you marry me? My husband won't mind if you stay out of the bedroom.