Allow the Captain to regale you with a tale.
Many years ago, when the Captain was a younger, but competent lieutenant, he fancied himself quite the catch. He had a daytime job that paid moderately well, moonlighted as a ballroom dance instructor, was a property owner, and had no student loans because he worked through college. He was not the latest or the greatest, but he was certainly smarter than the average bear. And his dating record proved it.
However, while his dating record was exemplary, his bang record was not. Especially given the volume of dates he had. The vast majority of dates would not be followed by a second, and what few made it past the first date rarely made it to the third. And if the Captain were to go back into the archives and calculate the percentages, the "Percent Banged of Total Dated" was probably well below the industrial average. And the Captain at the time didn't quite know why.
Fast forward today, and add the retro-spective wisdom of teh interwebz, and it's pretty obvious why the Captain would have great success in dating, but marginal success with banging - he was cursed with being a "Marginally Attractive Man." No doubt about it, the Ole Captain IS a good-looking man. Back in the day "HotOrNot" rated him regularly above an 8. But the problem with such sites is it just considers your face. It does not consider something even more important to women - your height. And here the Captain failed (by no fault of his own) miserably. He is a mere 5'9". And women don't like men who are only 5'9".
This would explain the vast majority of dating phenomenon in both the Captain's and other "Marginally Attractive Men's" pasts. Sure, we'd land some dates, but few would be followed by a sequel. Yes, we'd nail some chicks, but you'd ne'er hear from them again. And I'm sure many of you shorter gentlemen have no shortage of stories where you and a taller girl were getting along swimmingly, perhaps even enroute to a more committed relationship, but in the end she would either go ghost on you or just give you a standard "I'm not ready for a relationship" response, in spite of your great chemistry together. Yes, it is tough being a"Marginally Attractive Man."
However, there may be a bit more science to being a "Marginally Attractive Man" and it comes from the embarrassingly exposing data that OK Cupid is known for - Women's horrendously and laughably skewed perception of male attractiveness.
Though the original article was purged from the internet (because we can't be letting the men know the embarrassing reality of female nature), reddit thankfully has it archived so you boys can see the reality you are facing. And whereas we can speculate about "why" women are this way, as I like to say "The why doesn't matter. All that matters is what is."
Women have a horrendously skewed, flawed, erroneous and delusional view of male attractiveness. Whereas men have an objective and statistically normal, real world view of female attractiveness. to men, the majority of women are "average" with fewer and fewer people on the uglier and prettier sides of the spectrum the further out you get. Women, however, consider 80% of men BELOW AVERAGE, when by statistical and mathematical reality ONLY HALF CAN BE BELOW AVERAGE.
Again, delusion.
Again, "WTF????"
Again, "Do you women hear yourselves???"
But, "it is what is."
It is here we "Marginally Attractive Men" must take a lesson from Adam Piggott and realize there are HUGE ramifications for this skewed view of male attractiveness. For in one of his podcast episodes he expounded on the risks associated with being a "marginally attractive man." More specifically, he explained that if you are REALLY ugly, you know you are and therefore do not put forth any precious effort, labor, time, and resources chasing women you can't get. Additionally, just as if you're very attractive, you don't have to put forth as much time, labor, energy, and resources into chasing women as they're throwing themselves at you. But if you're marginally attractive, then heaven help you because you're in a "kill zone" of sorts where sporadic, irregular, and inconsistent successes condemn you to invest more and more of your time and resources into getting women that you're statistically not likely to get. And this then makes it a vital economics lesson.
Mock them all you want the MGTOW's/VirginTOW's/Incels/TFL'ers are NOT wasting their time chasing women they can't get. Yes, they may be wasting their time obsessing and hating on women they can't get, but they're not actually wasting their time chasing them. This frees up inordinate amounts of time and resources they could repurpose and reinvest in other endeavors that will improve their lives - working out, their careers, their educations, fun, home maintenance, auto maintenance, traveling/reconnaissance, etc.
On the other side of the looks spectrum you have the few top dogs and alpha males that women "graciously" deem "better than average." I know statistically speaking this is 20%, but even 20% may not be high enough given women's hypergamous genetic programming. I'd argue you'd need to be top 10%. Regardless of the actual number, once you reach this "magical percentage threshhold" women WILL throw themselves at you. I've witnessed this many times with a good friend of mine who is hands down a 10. Women will literally walk up to him and ask him to take them home. We were hiking one time and a girl propositioned him right there on the hiking trail. Admittedly, he puts a lot of effort into his physique, but it's a phenomenon very similar to a job hunt and majoring in engineering. If you're willing to put forth the effort into getting a hard degree, the rest of the world does the work for you in landing a job. And if you're willing to spend a couple hours at the gym, women will beat a path to your doorstep, even tying a cute little red bow to their vaginas as they present it to you as a gift. That larger point is that the time/labor/resource savings are IMMENSE if you are a top 10% good looking guy. Women do all the work for you, you don't have to lift a finger (though you do have to lift the weights).
But if you're a 6.5 or a 7.5, or you're a solid 9, but 5'7" you are in for a world of hell. Because you are neither too ugly to give up on women, nor are you too good looking that they beat a path to your door. This condemns you to expend inordinate amounts of labor and resources chasing girls.
Yes you can get a girl...you just have to spend month's worth of Saturday nights at loud, drunk, night clubs.
Yes you can get a girl...you just have to date a score of them and hope they're adequately drunk to lower their skewed standards to "normal" so you might get laid one time.
Yes you can get a girl...but you need to spend cumulatively years on social media swiping left or running "facebook game."
When you add it up, especially when you are younger, the amount of time, labor, resources, and plain ole life marginally attractive men waste on women is enough to pay for a house, earn a doctoral degree, travel the world, and/or learn a whole host of skills and trades that would improve your future immeasurably better. It is the most compelling argument for prostitution if there ever was one, but unfortunately, genetics (not to mention the law) compel most young "marginally attractive men" to waste their most precious youth and time in chasing tail that "might" reward them.
The solution for Marginally Attractive Men is to choose one and commit to it. You either are a 7.5 who could turn into a 9.5 if you dedicated yourself to becoming ripped, or you are a 7.5, already ARE ripped, and no further improvement is possible, so you might as well hang it up, go traditional-MGTOW and pursue your own personal interests. But whatever you do, do not indecisively sit in the middle of the train tracks, wasting your finite and precious life chasing tail with only a modicum percent chance of success. Your life is too valuable, you are too valuable, and your time can be invested in things with much higher rates of return. Though, remember, a monthly flight to Amsterdam or Las Vegas is infinitely cheaper than years worth of chasing tail you may or may not get.
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22 comments:
Thank god for pre-internet days. Female choice was very limited. No Tinder Facebook POF or the other numerous dating sties. The circle was small. A male 7 could get female 8 and 9's. Oh the joys of being a boomer Clary.
I have to say it but a solid D&B rating with income in 7 figure territory beats ripped every time. Having both is a killer regardless of height.
There are two crazy guys who think they are ninjas in my town. One is a chubby 3/10 and one is a lean 9/10. Guess which one has six baby mommas?
I think you've captured an important social phenomenon in this post.
I view myself as a marginally attractive man. My experience was much like you described. So I took heed of red pill advice to improve myself and attempt to become a man women want.
All the work I put in was more effective than what I experienced previously; the women I met were attractive, but that was about all they had to offer. It dawned on me that while I was doing all this work to better myself the better than average women did nothing but expected even more.
That's when I went MGTOW. Haven't looked back since. I don't hate women I just don't much like them for anything more than sex now. Sex is cheap.
To be fair - we consider 80% of ALL people to be less than average. Even women. Which makes my husbands brain explode because we all know what the term "average" means mathematically. But it doesn't matter. Hell... to me - I'm ~barely~ average! And not on the good side.
But the truth of the matter is an ugly girl has a better chance of finding a mate than an average male because of the magic V. It's just the way life is.
I've seen this myself, I'm in the marginally attractive category (or was during my prime) and my experience was pretty much like yours. I was friends with some guys that were in the top 10% and can say without a doubt that the women were crawling all over them whenever we went out.
666 formula
6 foot
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6 figure income
"Women, however, consider 80% of men BELOW AVERAGE"
This just serves to re-enforce the notion that (most) women suck at MATH in general, and statistics in particular !
“Women have a horrendously skewed, flawed, erroneous and delusional view of male attractiveness.”
The same is true of their view of their own attractiveness as well. How many of these uuhhmmaaayyyyyzzzziiinnngg women are average at best? And yet, they think they deserve some top one percent type, or chase criminals. For the latter, check up on the hundreds if not thousands of women who chased Ted Bundy and Scott Peterson, among others.
Better yourselves, guys. Make a life for yourself you enjoy, and don’t bother with them anymore. Even if one deigned to look at you, you’d be the guy she settles for, and why would anyone be flattered to be someone’s last resort?
While you may be one inch under the median for height, that is not it. Men over six foot are having trouble too. It is as if women have a list of restrictions that, when applied, whittle down men to less than one percent. The point is, they would have found something to reject you for. That is what they do. That is why the OkCupid stats are so distorted.
I'm 5'10 and I don't mind if a guy is shorter than me, but I think most of them don't like the fact that I'm taller than them.
Isn't this also a point to go after foreign woman? While the odds still aren't good they would stay, if more women were brought into the US, you think their requirements would drop somewhat. More completion so to speak.
And I think it is even worse than you state. If 80% of the women are only interested in the top 20 % of menand half of those men are married. It's probably closer to 70% of the women are only interested in 10% of the men. Follows a verse in Isiah I think. Where 7 women were asking 1 man to just give them his name.
Haha. I can totally relate in this category Aaron. I'm 32, work out 4-6 times a week (looking to get back into sports like rugby), have a good job and good financial stats. However, I'm 5'7", and even that may be pushing it. Most women don't even like men that they "can't wear heels" around, so there goes about half the pool right there. Then the rest, you're still competing against non-vertically challenged men. It's not crippling, but it is annoying
For most of the twentieth century there has been a shortage of men. WW1, WW11, Korea, Vietnam, dangerous work places all took their toll. In the 1950's which an awful lot of people consider our best days, there was a very big shortage of men, the survivors of the war who weren't cripples would be seriously outnumbered by women. Now there are slightly more men that women. I am sure that this has had some impact.
"I only date guys who are taller than six foot two."
"I only fuck chicks who are shorter than five foot eight."
That's a problem I solved long ago.
Well, well, well ... the Captain finally acknowledges reality. I quit reading this forum several years ago after the Captain's well known disregard, hostility and contempt for MGTOWs.
Cappy ... glad you finally accepted reality. Awesome. So, here's another bit of reality that you can choose to accept now ... or years down the road ... when you finally figure it out for yourself. For most men, there is very little they can do to increase their MV. The 7.5 you referenced who turns himself into a 9.5 ... on a whim, upon working out and getting ripped. SORRY DUDE, THAT AIN"T HAPPENING. NEVER HAPPENS. CAN"T HAPPEN. WON"T HAPPEN.
For the vast, vast majority of men ... they can certainly decrease their MV easily ... by being obese, unemployed and broke, etc. But for increasing it dramatically ... nope that ain't happening, ever. Either you are good looking or you're not. Either you're tall or you're not. Either you're an extrovert or you're not. Either you have a decent IQ, job skills, jobs, and money or not. Yes, you can change things a bit and improve them ... with hard work, lifting, getting a better job, etc. But there isn't a 7.5 alive who can morph into a 9.5. Ain't happening. Improve to an 8 ? Sure, Maybe an 8.5. And, again, its about diminishing returns ... a 7.5 MIGHT be able to get to an 8.5 ... if he dedicates his entire life to it for years ...
Cappy, take the next step ... the average man (MV:5) can't morph into a top 10% stud that women drool over. Not ever. Improve a little bit ... with strong diminishing returns ... sure.
Interesting read. And likely spot on. I have a 40 ish engineer friend who has some wealth, is fit as heck, attractive. Owns a home and is quite polite and decent to be around. He has had several good relationships that have ended exactly as you have described. He is just 5'-6". It has been terribly hard on him because even though they don't admit it, it is because of his height. Shameful.
Spend a hundred bucks at a massage parlor once a month. Problem solved, no drama, no child support, no divorce. Use a condom or get " manual satisfaction " only.
What makes you think that? I'm 6'2", and the prospect of a female partner taller than me has me thinking about practicing triangle chokes naked, and wanted to sire a small tribe of giants.
These days if you want an attractive "traditional wife type" you only answer is Asian, or South American. Don't get me wrong, they won't just fall in your lap, and there is a whole list of factors at work overseas. But your odds are exponentially better.
Just don't bring her back here!!!
Very interesting article, and true. I hadn't seen this idea put forward on the manosphere before.
I'm in my mid-30's, and I'm doin' OK, but I wasted a HUGE amount of time in my late 20's/early 30's trying to find a girlfriend, mostly via online dating. It is a HUGE time sink. I think when you take time spent, and investment opportunities not acted on over those years because of the 'find a woman' mission, it cost me tens of thousands.
I stopped online dating a year or so after Tinder came on the scene and just made it outright impossible for 'normal' dudes. I've never done Tinder but I know guys who have, and some have spent YEARS messaging loads of women, giving them attention, and have gotten no sex.
Young betas are now playing women's games, i.e. becoming social media zombies, in the hope that women will see how interesting they are and bang them. Or giving women endless attention on social media, not thinking "hold on, there's 20 other dudes talking to her right now and she just loves the attention; this is a fucking waste of my time!".
Stop playing their game and start playing your own.
Dude I know told me a story, a decent looking woman he knows spent 4 days in a different city for a conference, and started up Tinder - she had 150 matches and 40 guys asking her on dates over those 4 days.
You can't compete with that. You just can't. Don't waste your life trying to.
As I said, I'm doin ok. I live on half my income and have about $220K in savings. I keep in good health; low bodyfat ect....but I'm quite beta looking. I admit that. In today's marketplace I might land an obese woman if I was lucky. I don't want that. So I've stopped wasting time looking.
I absolutely love your stuff Aaron, but I have to disagree here.
As you correctly stated, you're a good-looking guy. We're probably similarly good-looking, and if anything, you may be slightly better.
If women are saying "I'm not ready for a relationship" it has nothing to do with your looks. It's a neediness issue.
Become non-needy, non-reactive and non-compliant, and watch your results sky-rocket fellas.
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