Thursday, January 01, 2015

The Nicene Creed of MGTOW

Put together this video request.

Which insulted some people in the MGTOW community, prompting this response video.

I don't like getting bogged down in technicalities, semantics, details, let alone being misquoted or taken out of context, so I put together this final "Nicene Creed" of MGTOW.

I then walk away because I refuse to get bogged down in semantics, technicalities, details, and sophistry, and have said my peace.

Post-post - Paul Elam chimes in with some reasoned, ahem "veteran" advice.


grey enlightenment said...

you're right, but I think you're wasting your time. You cannot convince people who are incable of changing their minds

James Wolfe said...

I've noticed for a while now there is a great divide within the manosphere. On one end you have the PUA's and the other MGTOW. The most successful PUA's are extreme advocates of Game. They truly believe that all men can benefit from Game and can have as much success as they want with women. All they have to do is work out, look nice, and have the right attitude. And any man who fails to succeed is just lazy or weak or a failure. But this is not true. All the confidence in the world will not help a man who women do not find attractive. You could be just plain ugly. You could have a speech impediment. You could be horribly shy. Or you could just be socially awkward. You can work on all those things but if women still don't find you attractive being self confident and trying to approach them will just get you labeled as creepy or a stalker. And getting shot down like that will destroy any self confidence you may have.

Also most PUA's are not in it for the same reasons most men are. Most men want long term and at some point permanent relationships. PUA's are in it for the short term pleasure while avoiding the long term risk. They never have to experience their hearts being ripped out, being taken advantage of, losing everything of value, everything they earned. So they don't know what it's like to be MGTOW. Many of us MGTOW were once just like them. The only difference is years of experience in real relationships. We're burned out, we've had enough, we're done. We now as you said reprioritize women. They may not even make the top 10 things on our list. Having been married and had kids they are probably not even in the top 20 or 30 for me. I've already done my bit for king and country. I've fulfilled my societal obligations of husband and father. I'm finally ready to live for me.


James Wolfe said...

Those who are in the third category you mentioned I would say are the ones who know that no amount of self improvement or game will ever make them attractive to women. They've tried. They've seen that it made no difference. They've been shot down too many times in bars, been made fun of in front of their friends, been friend zoned, had girls pretend to like them only because they were being used, and so their impression of women in general is very different from them men who are successful. The man who picks up the good looking woman because he's got game and she thinks he's hot, she's the same "bitch" or "whore" that shot down the other guy and laughed at him in front of her girl posse, and is the same woman that a MGTOW would ignore on his way from the bar to the toilet to take a piss. All women are not like that? It depends on who the man is. All women are like that if all you get is stomped on. All women are not like that if all that matters is getting them in bed. All women are like that if you want one worth spending the rest of your life with and they screw you and take everything from you.

The second group might have had some experience with women, seen what bad experiences others have had, and are currently enjoying their life too much to let a woman tie them down, or force them to settle. My nephew is going to med school next year. He's very charming, good looking, athletic, goes rock climbing, kayaking, biking, you name it. He had a really cute girlfriend who also enjoyed outdoor activity. But she made the ultimatum. Buy me a ring or I walk. If he bought her a ring she'd own him. He'd have to settle down. If he got married now his dreams of becoming a doctor are over as I'm sure his parents wouldn't pay for his tuition if he ran off and got married. So he said no. So she lost that one. And he's still enjoying life, working hard, and has new friends.

I'm fairly sure that there are at least three groups but I don't believe that all of them in group three are whiners. Maybe there is a fourth group that truly are cowards and whiners and don't even want to try to be a man. If they are I feel sorry for them. If not for the experience, good and bad, that I have had I wouldn't know how much better off I am now that I don't NEED a woman in my life. I'd still LIKE to have one, but my world doesn't revolve around them. I have women friends and that is enough for now.

Captain Capitalism said...

James, those aren't people in the third group. If they TRIED, then by default they can't be in the third group.

James Wolfe said...

What I meant is the people in the third group who are accused of just whining about it may have at some time in the past tried or just plain know that they are beyond geeky and unpopular with women and gave up without ever really trying. But yeah, there are people who are just plain lazy and don't bother trying and claim they are in group two.

James Wolfe said...

I liked your analysis. People do tend to get over zealous in trying to define every group in the manosphere. We're not identical parts that can be sorted into bins. There is a vast spectrum of opinions and places for everyone within the manosphere. There is even room for blue pills. They just haven't found their way yet. If they can live their lives happy to be a door mat fulfilling their daily honey do lists then more power to them. If not we'll welcome them when the time comes.

Glen Filthie said...

The manosphere has produced two toxic movements, IMHO - the pick up artists and the MGTOWs.

Boys, the answer to problems with the modern woman are the same today as they were in the 40's and earlier: formal, lengthy courtship. Society isn't picking on you - if you jump in the sack with any piece of crap without regard to how she thinks and deserve everything you get.
Choose your women with the same care and deliberation you use to choose your rifle or pistol. Go slow during the courtship process, and spend time - don't spend money. Choose your women with care and don't be shy about rejecting them if they don't measure up...but ya want to do that BEFORE you have huge amounts of money and time invested in them.
What social liberals don't understand is that if sex means nothing - then family ties don't either. The old world attitudes and values about dating and marriage produced happy marriages for your grandparents and they can do the same for you.

Black Poison Soul said...

Listened to both videos, I agree with what you've said in them. Not sure why some of the MGTOW people got bent out of shape about the first one - you must have hit the painful mark with it for them, else why all the smoke and flames huh.

Keep it going, always a pleasure to read and listen/watch.

SM777 said...

"The old world attitudes and values about dating and marriage produced happy marriages for your grandparents and they can do the same for you."
Earlier in the 20th century and before that, sure, flat out true.

However, with the divorce court laws and system the way it is now, the risk of losing everything a man has owned, or ever worked for is far too great.

And it all depends upon the whim of the woman...........

Take The Red Pill said...

"Buy me a ring or I walk."

What chutzpah! In this day of the "strong", "independent" woman, is that supposed to be a threat?? I hope he told her something to the effect,"The door is over there -- don't let it hit your ass on the way out."
In this day of Marriage 2.0, Frivorce, and the government and legal system support of legalized misandry, male abuse, and The Divorce Industry, women have burned their bridges behind them WRT relationships, commitment, or even marriage. Simply being around them while at work is becoming too much of a hazard.
A woman nowadays need to learn that simply being born with a vagina does not 'entitle' her to relationships, commitment, or marriage anymore, no matter how much she says that she's "not a feminist" or "Not Like That". They have set up the legal system to operate on their behalf ONLY and at their beck and call, and have backed it up with the Guns of Government.
"Buy me a ring or I walk"?? Go ahead and WALK!
Women who are WORTHY of rings and marriage DON'T HAVE TO issue ultimatums. (Which shows how few women there are in modern society that DESERVE marriage.)