The LADIES (Bill Burr emphasis) over at Return of Queens came up with an explanation of their scale of attraction for men on a scale of 1-10...
they ATTEMPTED to come up with a scale of 1-10, but being the lovely females they are, nothing is ever so simple. Their attraction to males is a bit more multi-faceted for a simple linear scale, so it became a list of "do's and don't's" instead. Perhaps not as simple as us men were looking for, but helpful nonetheless.
However, one of the best bits of advice was about short men, specifically, how women are just not attracted to them, and this needs to be expanded a little more for the benefit of our shorter brothers.
If you were like me and every other boy/man in America, you were brought up believing what your parents and teachers told you - that women would like you for you and just be yourself blabbity blah blah blah. You were also maybe told women preferred dark, TALL, men, but that was the extent to which height was addressed. And thus you were sent out into the world, thinking your height was no serious disadvantage. That like you, women weren't bigoted against people shorter than them and just as you were comfortable dating a girl taller than you, women would be comfortable dating men shorter than them.
Oh, how wrong you were. For while not addressed or talked about much, height is arguably the number one thing women look at. And I would go so far to say they are repulsed by shortness on a level almost as much as men are repulsed by fat.
While I have seen no studies, anecdotally there is enough data a study doesn't have to be commissioned. It is usually the case women are shorter than their partner. Only during my "ballroom dancing prime" was I able to score taller girls (and they would usually not stick around). And we can of course take what the ladies at ROQ are saying at face value. But if there is a case study that proves the "shortness handicap" it is my much more ripped IT counterpart. This "friend" is basically me on steroids and improved in every other category.
He makes six figures
He is an infinitely better mechanic than I am
He is a computer genius
He races cars and rides motorcycles
He's way more ripped than I am
Has a nicer house
Has a nicer car
Has a higher networth
he is an accomplished dancer AND musician.
You could not really improve a human more.
But, alas, he is 5'9", and that's where he "fails." Matter of fact it was a conversation we had about a month ago that prompted me to look at shortness as such a handicap, and the ROQ piece confirms it. You can be the most accomplished man in every aspect of your life, superior to most of your competitors, but if you're short, you might as well be that "fat girl with a *great* personality."
So what is a short guy to do?
Well the primary purpose of this post is to at least MAKE YOU AWARE of your handicap. I do this NOT to berate you or make you feel bad, but to improve your chances with women. A soldier that goes into battle unaware of his greatest weakness or operating on false information is going to fail compared to a soldier that DOES know his greatest weakness and makes decisions accounting for it. So if you are short (I would say 5'10" or shorter) REALIZE and ACCEPT women are just not going to be as attracted to you.
Don't listen to what your parents say
Don't listen to what your friends who are girls say
Don't listen to what society says
If you are working out, interesting, good looking, and doing everything "right," if you're short THAT is the reason you are failing with women, just like FAT is the reason woman will fail with men.
Second, well while a fat girl can always lose weight (well, according to science and biology anyway, HAR HAR HAR!), a short man simply cannot increase his height. There is no "solution" to height.
Correct, so, like the ladies at ROQ point out, you are merely going to be relegated to shorter girls.
This is alright because, again, men really don't care that much about height. And there's plenty of short girls around. The problem is (as many online dating profiles will show you) short girls are just as picky as their taller female counterparts when it comes to the height of men. Profiles are abound of 5'1" girls DEMANDING a man 6'0" or taller. This "height spread" combined with the fact taller men aren't going to turn down a girl based on height, pushes short men out of the "height market."
Regardless, you're just going to have to "aim low" and not bother approaching taller girls.
Do women put on makeup?
Do women wear clothes that adjust their shape?
Do women wear heels?
Women lie all the time about their appearance, so the least you can do is lie about your height.
Of course, this isn't Gattica, so how do you lie?
Pull a Prince and get some platform shoes. Nothing 4" or anything as drastic as that, but an additional 1.5" will still look like a "normal" shoes, but mayhaps give you that edge you need.
Fourth, charm. I am a student of Walter Matthau because the man did not look like Steve McQueen, but still managed to be charming. It won't fully compensate for being short (as my IT doppelganger has shown), but a devastating charm can add a couple inches in height.
Finally, if push comes to shove, Asian and Latin countries. Women in these countries tend to be short. And of course this is doing no service to our Asian or Latino brothers, but sorry guys, all's fair. If height is pushing you out of the taller-Anglo/Scandinavian/basketball-player market, you'll just have to go to cultures where women are biologically shorter.
Whatever strategy or strategies you choose to pursue, the key lesson to pull from this is to realize just what a severe handicap being short is for a guy. It's not a "minor" inconvenience. It's not "something shallow girls insist on." It is a genetically hardwired preference of women, neither to be berated or shamed. It is a law, and a law you need to abide by.
This post is spot on: being short is pretty much a dealbraker for the majority of western women these days. Even if they would go on a few dates with a short guy, they would NEVER consider him acceptable for a long-term relationship.
I would disagree with the advice of aiming for shorter girls though: from my experience, the girls who are the most focused on height, are the shorter girls (maybe, they are subconsciously trying to compensate?). It's actually the taller than average girls, who are more open to dating shorter guys.
I am 5' 9" and only very rarely does a tall woman look down her nose at me. I have dated several women taller than myself. Recently an Argentine tango partner explained to me - quite early in our relationship - that she would never date someone my height. A week later she was commenting on how I 'have a tall presence.' If a man believes that taller women are not attracted to him then that belief WILL limit his options. A man who has faith in his worth to women AND who knows how to lead will soon have the tallest woman happily kneeling before him.
Things to remember:
- Women crave being led.
- Women seldom know what they want and usually can't explain it when they do.
- Men find no end of excuses to bail out on an attractive woman before giving her a chance.
- Good eye contact and big brother/little sister relationship comes a bit more naturally when a woman is gazing UP into the eyes of a man. A short man will not be able to accidentally have this happen, he has to MAKE it happen with strong eye contact and strength of character.
There are some tricks - tilting the head back just a hair when looking at a woman who is taller - it gives the same effect as if you were taller and looking down... Men who have that magic touch amount of arrogance do this naturally. (credit for noticing this goes to heartiste)
I generally only wear cuban soled shoes (1 1/4" lift) when dancing with a partner in high heels. When a gal has long gams to begin with and stacks them on 4" heels you do need to have 'a tall presence' to balance her.
Short is like under 5'7, not 5'10, 5'10 is slightly over average,...tall is 6' over
I'm 5'8.5 or so... in some ways it's a blessing it makes MGTOW easier, you don't have to deal with women's BS. I don't dislike being slightly short anymore.
Talked to a very short (̃4 ft 11) woman during my single days, and she explained why short women want tall guys. It was because that if she was walking outside among other people with a short guy, she felt like they were children.
I'm 6foot3, so I guess I qualified. She was very short, which I didn't mind, but spherical, which I did mind very much indeed.
I know a Filipina who is about 5, 5'1" and she thinks 5'6" is tall.
Good post. The challenge with Latinas and Asian women is that you have to LIKE them. Latinas are not very smart, and Asians are Asian. Eastern Europeans are not so picky about height but the language barrier is an issue. One can certainly LEARN those languages, but for a word-focused dude, nothing really compares to dating a woman who thinks in your native tongue.
I think you were closest to the mark with your comment on ballroom dancing. If you are DOING something alpha, then the women will be drawn to you. That's the best solution, I think. Pull them into you. Like Napoleon. In fact, it may be the only solution if you are short and seek white english speakers.
Or, one could go to Eastern Europe and live there for a few years. Get so good at the language that you can think it in it and get 50%+ of the humor. That would work too.
Another idea is Italy and Spain. They are pretty short there.
I think only 12% of the male population is over 6 feet. Throw in married, sick or looks like Frankenstein, you are looking at a very low percentage of available males over 6 feet. You would think women would factor this in their decision making a scale back that particular demand.
If you are in the west, you could wear cowboy boots or another type of boot with large heel. One thing I've noticed is people seem to systematically misrepresent height - they seem to count at least basic shoes and hair and will argue with you if you try and factor those out when doing things like buying a suit.
Anyway, I'm pretty tall and would prefer not to date a shorter woman, just like I would not date anyone earning less than 100k/year. That said women, don't like me either. I also did the stuff on your friends list except race cars and the music.
I suggest we start a short shaming week.
( snerk )
My spouse is shorter than I am. Height was not a factor as his personality and self confidence outshone the height difference. The only place it really has an effect is when we dance, the difference is enough to make turning under his arm difficult especially if I wear heels.
I'm not so sure this is as big (heh) an issue as you make out.
I'm 5 foot 6. Just as women taller than me don't find me attractive, I've never been sexually attracted in person to a woman taller than me. I might appreciate that she is pretty, sexy etc, but no women taller than me has ever passed the boner test. We are self selecting each other out of contention.
Being short means that there is a higher bar to cross to get into play (this is where game comes in) but once you have built attraction most women's demands for a 6 foot guy quickly get rationalized into simply 'he must be taller then me'.
I'm in the UK where the average height of women is 5 foot 3 inches. If I can't get a women when about 60% of them are shorter then me, the problem isn't my height, it's my game.
I'm not having a pop but this is not the first time that I have come across taller guys assuming that being short is a serious issue in getting with women. It means you have to put more work in and make more effort perhaps, but ultimately women are women. They crave to submit to a man worthy of their submission. Be that man and they will rationalize away your shortness, the same way they rationalize away any bit of reality that doesn't fit the narrative they are following in their head.
I will say though, that really short girls are the ones that are most insistent on taller men - I think this is related to regression to the mean. If you are a shorter guy, IME, you are best advised to put your efforts into women who are only 1 to 2 inches shorter than you.
I'm 6 feet tall, and once was turned down by a gal who was 6'1". Honest to god, she told me she only dates men taller than her. haha
I am 5'9"" and routinely dated tall women all of my life. Until I read this post I had no idea i had a supposed handicap. I've dated professional models, airline hosties, you name it.
To quote Sean Connery when asked what were the three most important assests for a man to have for attracting women:
Confidence, confidence, and confidence.
Every time I come here, I have one more reason to serve nobody other than myself.
short girls are better anyway, other than for making tall sons. in every other respect they are my preference.
i'm 2m which is bordering on too tall.
This all goes to how outrageoeus present day women's standards have gotten. 5'9" is average height. In the all too recent past, a four inch difference was considered ideal, qualifying your freind for a 5'5" woman. Doable then but, not now.
Where in the heck do they get off?
Really appreciate this post Cappy. It's almost like a third rail subject that people know exists but won't address.
I'm a short skinny guy, 5'5' and 130 pounds and anyone that doesn't think that a slight stature is a hindrance in dating life has never had to live in my shoes. I have had girls literally laugh in my face and exclaim that they'd never be seen with a short guy. That's a real comforting feeling.
I've found myself making the fat girl analogy as well. "There's nothing wrong with me if you would only look past my shortcomings (both literally and figurative) you'd see what a great person I am.
It really does mess with your head and it really has no basis in logic. All I can figure is it's a throwback to the caveman days where getting with someone big and strong was the difference between eating and starving. They always go "Well Tom Cruise is short too" as some sort of justification but the exception proves the rule. He's a wealthy Hollywood celebrity and that offsets his height.
It's also been my mostly my experience that the shorter they are the more they want a taller guy, never mind how ridiculous a 4'10" girls looks with a 6'3" guy.
Thanks for the linkage Captain.
I didn't write the piece but I did like it. I do agree that most women like men who are taller than they are. Keely likes men who are tall.
Then there are women like me who like men who are are merely taller than they are. I know that's how I view things. I don't consider 5'9" short. I consider short to be anything shorter than I am. I'm 5'7". So to me, 5'6" would be short.
I agree a lot with what DD said. Good eye contact is VERY important. However, I would be careful with the head up-tilt. You can come off looking snotty/arrogant. What DD says about a presence that seems tall is dead on. I've dated men shorter than me, but it wasn't as noticeable because they acted like they just didn't care. So I didn't either.
I can only speak for myself, but to me, self confidence trumps almost everything else. You could be a little shorter, or have a bit of a belly, or have little to no hair, or not make a lot of money, or drive an old used car, but if you know how to work what you've got with confidence, women will be drawn to you. I don't care what all the other websites say. Men with less than perfect characteristics CAN find women, but, if they don't have confidence, they are basically doomed.
Just my opinion of course. I'm just a woman, so what do I know?
This is pure click bait. C'mon Cappy, you know that 5'10 is not "short". I know plenty of guys in the 5'9-5'10 who are pulling. They aren't millionaires either.
Vladimir Putin and Napoleon would disagree.
What genetic or social advantage is there in being a tall woman? They're on the extreme right end of the bell curve for a trait with no practical use. So they have to limit the pool of men they pursue so that they don't feel big and awkward. These women are deeply insecure with themselves.
One thing you could do is make game of it. Make light jokes you're looking for a down to earth girl, insinuate that she's awkward and clumsy, etc. It does two things:
1. Eases her anxiety with humor
2. Reminds her that she's the outlier, not you
My best bud is short as hell. He is also pale and skinny, impulsive, terrible with money, has a bad temper, has difficulty with academics, and is shit for a long term mate.
With that said, the guy is fun as hell, has no fear, and is an amazing critical thinker. In social settings he is two steps ahead of everyone, he is an expert at reading covert communication, and is never at a loss for words.
His game is impeccable. He's also got be bad boy vibe going for him as well. Girls love him. Since my red pill ingestion, I've literally seen every game principle personified by him.
Being short isn't a death knell, you can make up for it, but you've got to be exceptional. My buddy is exceptional even though most of us would dismiss him at first glance.
Where did my original comment go? I'll try again:
Every woman I ever dated was taller. My ex-wife was two inches taller.
If all this was true, I'd never have gotten a date and yet at 18 I found myself dealing with two simultaneous pregnancy scares with two girls.
What's also unspoken here is that a lot of men say they won't ever date a fat women but do. So use that for women and short guys.
Finally, I think this post is a deliberate cockblock for short guys. It's not advice. It's saying "don't bother." This reminds me of when I took one of the hottest girls in school to prom (three inches taller) and guys like Cappy Cap were saying "She's only going with you because no one else asked her." That leaves out everything about our relationship except height. Logical problem there. Two decades later she friended me on Facebook, so I think what we had was pretty real, haters aside.
-- Days of Effing Broken Arrows
I'm a woman who is 5'3". My ex was 6'1". I swear that the next man I date will be about 5'6". I always felt like I was getting a neck ache from looking up at him. We could never dance together cause we looked silly. (I felt like I needed to stand on his feet like with my Dad years ago). If a woman turns a man down solely based on height, then she is a bubble head and you shouldn't waste your time anyway.
I'm confused...where at any point in that entire article did she mention women not like "short" guys?
The only mention of height was in her first bullet point, where she said women want men that are TALLER THEN THEY ARE.
This makes sense...so considering that the average female height is 5'5 in the states, and the average male height is somewhere around 5'9 5'10... I don't understand where this entire post stemmed from.
If a woman is your height or shorter after wearing heels, you're good to go. Telling men that 5'10 is SHORT confuses me. 5'10 is slightly above average, not to mention...WOMEN HAVE no freaking idea what they are talking about, much less how tall a man actually is when they meet him in person.
If you know anything about game, you know that it doesn't matter what a woman SAYS she wants. It only matters what she RESPONDS to. Unfortunately, women have no idea what that is, and if they did, they would never admit it.
Just look at danny from danny504.com, he's 5'4 130-140 lbs and cleans up.
I'm 5'10 and I won't even go into detail, and have friends that are 5'8 that clean up with some of the best looking women I've seen, constantly beating out my taller 6'1 friends who are good looking but have no game and no balls.
Honestly, this post really confused me.
It's all about attitude and confidence as this has never been an issue for me. I've dated a woman who was 6'1" who usually wore heals and my ex wife was 5'10
". If you walk around worrying about your short comings (excuse the pun) you are going to project that in your attitude and physiology. Quite honestly I forget that I'm short until I see my reflection standing next to people who are taller or I'm engaged in a discussion about height. So seriously guys, don't worry about it. And if you are, dress and talk like you have money and height will not be an issue. I'm a jeans and T shirt guy and am always myself because I don't need to be validated by women to feel good about myself.
I'm 6'2". At that height, I should realistically never have to engage a woman taller than me, right? Wrong. I met a woman who was probably 6'4" in a local bar, who had once been on a scholarship to Miami for volleyball.
It was an interesting situation for me, because at the time I acknowledged my lack of discomfort in engaging a taller woman was totally mitigated by the fact that I was above average for height, a.k.a. she was the freak show.
I couldn't help myself though, when it came to asking her questions about men who were shorter, being interested in her. Now at her height, everything was exaggerated, but basically her problem with shorter men was entirely perception, based on those guys constantly referencing the height difference. She said she had no problem being out with a shorter guy- it was the shorter guys having a problem being out with her that made an impact. So maybe if you go at a woman who's taller, never bring it up and let all your other assets take the lead?
Here is the killer way to pick up shorter girls:
Tell them that you think shorter girls are cute, but you would never marry one because you don't want your daughters to have short, stubby legs.
This comment will drive a spear of hurt directly into the pride of the average short girl.
If she tries to tell me I am short, I will say "sure, but not as short as you. I don't want to raise dwarves, so if we have sex, I'm using protection."
Never be afraid to be cruel to the gals. After all, they are the ones who taught me how to do it.
that feel when short guys try to rationalize away the fact that having to look up at a woman is a detriment
Two more pieces of advice on shoes.
1: Some traditional business shoes have a 2" heel, but an only slightly raised toe. This makes you look taller, but gives the optical illusion that your shoes aren't doing anything.
2: Women who wear heels often can actually become confused and think they're naturally tall. This happens because many women suffer body dysmorphia. Only way to reduce this is to pick a woman who is smaller, wears small heels or doesn't wear them often/at all, which will increase how tall she perceives you to be.
True. Even Fat girls demand tall athletic guys.
Also, men have a height bias with other guys. Army officer promotion lists are severely height biased. Tall guys get an automatic "natural leader" qualification without ever having to prove it.
5' 9" isn't short--it's the average height of men in the US. By definition, short means a height under 5' 9".
Ask a group of women to define short, and I'd wager the majority would answer "under 6' tall." As someone pointed out, only 12% of men are 6' or tall. Which means women believe 88% of men are below average in height.
This lines up with a recent Plenty of Fish survey that found that women rate 80% of men as being below average in looks.
It's a clear example of the apex fallacy. Women believe men at the top of the attractiveness index are more common than they actually are.
You may want to consider turning this analogy on its head. A tall man is like a busty woman. Regardless of their other shortcomings, they will always get a second look from the opposite sex, because they have an attribute the opposite sex finds attractive.
The lesson here is to play up your strength. Busty women have understood that for centuries.
But, how many tall men deliberately emphasize their strongest attribute--size? How many wear clothing styles that reinforce their size (like darker colors that give the impression of greater size) or stand and sit in a way that takes up more physical space? Not many I would guess.
The point is to play to your strength (whatever it is) and play down your weakness, whatever they are.
You have it right there 8to12, adn so does the captain Eug. The problem is not so much 5'9 is short, but that so many girls perceive anything under 6' to supposedly be 'short', without realising actually 5'9 (5'10 in my youngish age group) is actually the peak of the bell curve. Partly because so many girls seem to "want somone two inches taller than me", but then include heels so high a stripper wouldn't wear them outside work when measuring themselves.
I am a tall and traditionally handsome man and I would absolutely never marry a short girl. The main reason? Because girls are always telling me how great my height is and how gross they find short men. There is a 65% chance that the offspring's height will come from the mothers side. If I breed with a short girl, then my son has a great chance of being short. That actually wouldn't bother me at all if it weren't for one thing: women being so damn picky about height. I have other tall friends that say similar things. I really think we're on an advent of short women having a hard time finding a husband. You short girls out there are shooting yourselves in the foot with all this tall-guy talk :-/
Yeah 5'10" is not short. It's maybe even slightly above average in the US.
I'm a 6'2" man, and some guys refer to me as tall even though I don't seem much taller than them. Unless there is a significant difference in height, you don't really notice that you're taller then other men.
So I imagine that women who are slightly taller don't notice the difference either, unless the woman is already a shorter girl, which means the man must be seriously short, like 5'3" short.
Believe me, if women only got with guys 6'0" or taller, we would have died as a species.
Found out on 20/20 in 2002 that my earlier data on the average height of men in this area was flawed because men tend to lie about their height by an average of 2 inches (they said that on the show which corresponds to my data. (I'm a Ph.D. health statistician). That's why it appeared that the average man was 5'11". So, I am, as it turn out after all, the exact average for men which is 5'9" and the average for women is 5'4". Go to:
http://www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/01statab/stat-ab01.html and click on Table 196 to get the cumulative percent distribution of population by height and sex 1988-94. This data is for the U.S. A recent article noted that the average height of men in the Netherlands was six feet even and 5'11" in Norwegians, Danes, and Swedes.
Here's an excerpt from the 20/20 show (Aug. 22, 2002):
To see if the women would go for short guys who were successful, ABCNEWS' Lynn Sherr created extraordinary résumés for the shorter men. She told the women that the shorter men included a doctor, a best-selling author, a champion skier, a venture capitalist who'd made millions by the age of 25.
Nothing worked. The women always chose the tall men. Sherr asked whether there'd be anything she could say that would make the shortest of the men, who was 5 feet, irresistible. One of the women replied, "Maybe the only thing you could say is that the other four are murderers." Another backed her up, saying that had the taller men had a criminal record she might have been swayed to choose a shorter man. Another said she'd have considered the shorter men, if the taller men had been described as "child molesters."
Looking up my earlier data I looked at a convenience sample of 200 'women seeking men' as an activity partner or for short/long term relationships that were 25-50 years old, Caucasian and within 50 miles of my location. This was based on a widely used computer-dating service. I further stratified my sample into two groups of 100 each: Group 1 characterized themselves as slim/slender, average, or athletic. Group 2 characterized themselves as 'a few extra pounds' or 'large'. Group1-Group 2
Percent of women taller than 5'9" (height of average man) 7%-6%
Percent of women judging 5'9" too short (not in preferred range) 35%-24%
Percent of women who say they would date someone shorter 5%-14%
Percent of women who did not specify a preferred height range 6%-9%
Percent women specifying men had to be a minimum of 3" taller 52%-28%
Percent women specifying men had to be a minimum of 5" taller 25%-11%
Percent women specifying men had to be a minimum of 7" taller 9%-2%
The same analysis for men showed that 39% of men specified they would go out with someone taller and another 14% gave no specification for height.
Among the five women in group 1 specifying they would go out with someone shorter, there were two who specified up to 1 inch shorter, one who specified 2 inches shorter, one 4 inches shorter, and one 7 inches shorter.
Among the 14 women in group 2 specifying they would go out with someone shorter, there were four who specified up to 1 inch shorter, six who specified 2 inches shorter, two 3 inches shorter, one 4 inches shorter, and one 7 inches shorter. In another words, in both groups 1 and 2, only 2% of women specified they would go out with someone more than 3 inches shorter than they were.
The average increase in height (rather than minimum acceptable) women wanted their men to be (in both groups 1 and 2) was 7 inches. However, the average man is only 5 inches taller than the average woman. No wonder women feel compelled to always be pointing out our 'shortcomings'.
Hmmmm, and they say men are superficial when it comes to looks??? Turns out women are equally if not more superficial!
I tend to view the "minimum height requirement" as another shit-test.
Look..women overestimate height the same way they do with penis size. Every girl I've ever spoken to when describing previous lovers penis size has always thought the size was one, two, or sometimes three! Inches longer then they really are. God bless them..but they just don't know wtf they are talking about.
One girl once told me she thought I had a big penis (I'm a little above avg) and that I was the biggest shed ever had. I asked her how big she thought it was and I had to laugh in her face when she gave me the number. Combine that with the fact that many guys will exaggerate by at least an inch when talking and there you have it.
Stop listening to whatever women say especially about height. Do women find taller guys more attractive? Sure. Does it help you in any way shape or form to even think about this? No...because there's nothing you can do about it anyway. Show me a guy that's 6' tall but wishes he were 6'2/6'3 and you'll get a guy that is inherently insecure just gets lucky with women or only gets girls that fall on his lap.
Then show me a 5'8 in shape guy that has absolutely no concept of height or that it even matters and feels like he's king of the world, and I'll show you a guy that cleans up with women...even the ones that SAY they would only date taller guys.
The irony is all this is that the same guys who complain that women only want taller guys, are the same ones that say that women don't know WTF they are talking about when they say "I just want a nice guy...that makes me laugh". Interesting how you can pick and choose the things women say that they don't actually respond to. Yet I don't hear them saying women don't know wtf they are saying when they say "I'm only attracted to tall guys". You can't have one but not the other...
Let's just call height issues what they really are - Excuses that guys need every time they get rejected by a woman, face some resistance, or don't take any action at all. It's a lot easier to say that women only want tall guys and bad boys when that gives you a nice cushy excuse to not do SHIT and then feel better about yourself because "you can't do anything about it".
What really attracts a woman? You all know...Confidence, a loud booming voice, physical touch to get them aroused DESPITE how they felt about you in the beginning, posture, eye contact...all that stuff.
Will some women reject guys based on their height? Sure. Will most women? HELL no. The main reason those guys get rejected is because they think their height is an issue in the FIRST place.
The fact that you have 6' tall guys starting threads asking about height and some saying they KNOW that if they were ONLY 6'2/6'3 THEN they'd clean up shows what a ridiculous issue this is.
This whole height thing is just perpetuated by guys looking for excuses nothing more. Your best best, regardless of your height is a state of absolute dillusional narcissism, so even if a girl does reject you then you never think it's about height, and only look for ways to improve your next approach.
Because that same guy that's reading threads and posts online talking about height are the ones that are going to use that as the first excuse when they talk to a women and they get less than a thrilling response from her from the get go.
Stop even imagining height as a factor in ANYTHING with women, always assume attraction despite her initial response, and watch how differently women respond and warm up to you.
That's the truth.
Yeah, shortness isn't that great. Not much you can do besides get really toned (if you get fully ripped, you'll just make it worse by decreasing height/width ratio) and wear shoes or boots with a pronounced heel on them. Cowboy boots and work boots are great for that. I'm 5'7" but with a good pair of boots I come off as 5'8" to 5'9."
There was one instance where a man who presumed he was AMOG attempted to nuke from orbit by saying "Hey there little guy." I just flashed my best impish grin and said deadpan monotone, "Did you know life expectancy decreases 6 months for every centimeter taller than average you are?" He really didn't have anything to respond to that and the asshole cred jumped through the roof.
I realize that this is really late, but the point number 5 on moving does work.
I am living proof.
Now, I did not move to Asia and Latin America.
I moved from Toronto-Occupied-Ontario and Denmark to DC.
Forget 5'9" - 6'2" w/o Latin features in T-O-O and 6'3" w/o big shoulders is not good enough in Denmark.
My point is that Aaron's basic point is absolutely right, but if you do your homework you can make moves that aren't quite so extreme.
I'm a 5'6 man, i agree with the article. My only gripe is how hard i have to work just to get a woman to like me when my taller counterparts literally only have to stand up. I've been patted on the head, called cute like a puppy, made fun of, asked was i going to grow taller, and the list goes on. I'm 35 now, i've come to accept what i cant change and just live with it. Nice car, money, homeowner, athletic, smart, honest,, it really doesnt matter because if a man is short, alot of women go for the taller guy. Sure i can settle for someone who does like me, but that wont make me happy. In 35 more years, i'll be 70, life is short, im short, just live life pay your taxes then you die.
5'9 is not short. It is the average height for most men. I would say about 90% of the male population is about 5'9. Also, a mans bank account is far more important to most women than his height. If you are deemed less than the ideal male because you are lacking in either area tell her to fuck herself and move on.
Many intelligent (and surprisingly non-derogatory) comments here, delineate most of what I could say. However, I'd like to point out something I feel the author is wrong about: the preference is reinforced far more by ingrained societal bigotry, than the "hard-wired" preference of women. I know the latter exists, but it's not the major factor.
There is a "solution": limb lengthening
Short men who whine and complain fall in the loser category and lose more man points than are already lost because of his perceived disadvantage.
The ones who persevere, never give up and never lose sight of their masculinity always win, sometimes over their taller counterparts.
You should be around SHORT SUCCESSFUL GUYS. Guys who are both short and successful and can give you tips so YOU become successful. Check out AtEyeLevel.co - The Site For The Successful Short Guy - http://www.ateyelevel.co
This is hilarious to me. I am like 5'3" and I ususally get the girl over the tall guy. I find that tall guys are intimidated by smaller men. If you are a smaller man and look good that is different than a small man that is ugly. Anyway this is not a fact in my case, truly smaller men are more rare and there is ugly ones in the rare numbers.
5'9 is NOT SHORT. It is average height. Are people so stupid, especially women, that they see only in black and white: i.e. tall & short. Medium exists you know. The author speaks of that 5'9 talented guy as though his height made him a leper.
5'9 isn't considered short at all. I'm 5'6
The problem is that women think they can't be protected with a shorter man, but it's proven that the greatest fighters are shorter guys. I also notice many tall guys who are wimpy, but they just look protective. I wouldn't compare short guys to fat people because fat is changeable, being short is genetics and can't be changed. If they're was a workout that made men taller, best believe there would be a lot more taller men. Many women don't care what kind of person a guy is, it's more of what they look like.
I didn't know that in the US 5'9" is considered short! As 5'10" is about the average for European and African origin males I honestly don't see 5'9" as short. Though saying that Ricky gervais is 5'9" and has made many references to being short...
I do think this is a real shame, but I am not free of it. I am 5'8" female, and have been really glad to see my sons get to nearly 6' because I know that this will advantage them generally in life. Like you say, being a short man WILL disadvantage you like being a fat woman (I know this because I am a fat woman who was slim once!).
I'm telling u, it goes back to boom booms. Shorter guys tend to weigh less, therefore less mass, therefore less sensation in the v zone when he's plowing away at u. Sorry it sucks but I believe that's where the whole short men are no good thing evolved from.
Here is positive proff that some women are stupid. Sorry but that's the way it goes.
5'9" is short??? Great...what chance do I (5'5") stand? none...even women my height don't find me attractive. I used to be outgoing, funny, great attitude, played guitar in a band...but being denied (even by ugly chicks who haven't had a date in years) has made me become immensely depressed and asocial. Even had a woman call me at work and tell me how awesome, nice, and great person I am...then she quickly made sure (the next day) to assure me she had no romantic interest. I'm done with humans, they are despicable and I hate every one of you.
But women can get skinny by working out , and men cannot get taller by working out.
Being short is equivalent to being fat for women? No. At least there are other cultures that appreciate larger women and find them desirable. Heck a fat woman can still have sex with good looking men. Maybe it won't lead to a relationship but it's something. There is no culture out there in the world that worships short men or have any respectable artistic representation of them as being deamed reliable. Women unlike men are less likely to settle for a short man for just sex. So no, short men are not equivalent to fat women. Short men are even worse.
You are shopping at the wrong store. I'm 5'11", in shape, living in a nice beach town in Chile. At the US I'd be in the average/dwarf zone. Here I'm rated as stud LOL. Girls over here are 5'3" to 5'6", many dating guys your height.
Couldn't care less about what European/American women think about my height, considering the material available over here:
I'm a woman. The height of a man isn't the issue, it's whether or not he can deliver in bed. If the dick is too small, the sex is simply not as good. Usually somewhere in the mid-range is fine, but if the size of the penis is small, it's just not satisfying sex. That's a pretty standard measure for women, and you can say this or that or argue about it back and forth all you want (particularly if you're men).
Another aspect to consider is how tall the men in a woman's family are. I am 5'8 and slender. My father is 6'2 and my brother is 6'3, and they are both huge burly dudes. I went to prom with a guy that was my height and thin. For me it was a bit awkward because I am used to being around men that have an offensive lineman build, so a guy that was 5'8 and thin, I felt like at times I could break him.
If you're short, you should visit south florida. Cubans are pretty short, and there's a lot of them in florida. I'm 5'8" and I got smiled at a lot when I was there in Miami, and talked to several women. I was only there for a day though.
As a tall woman (a little over 5'11), and one ego enjoys wearing heels when dressing up, I usually dated tall men. I probably did have some bias against short men, but I also never had any approach me and show interest, until about a year ago.
The man I'm with now is 5'6. At first, I worried it might be an issue, because he brought it up once. We met online, and so there was that uncertainty, but out want a problem in person. The reason is, he is confident and masculine, and he makes me feel safe. He doesn't have that insecurity that some sorry men supposedly have, or I don't see it if he does.
I do think it's funny that you equated bring short to being fat, because one thing I did notice in my pre-date social media stalking it's that many girls need been with ranged from chubby to straight up fat. I was too, when we got together (around 190 lbs), but bring with him made me want too be better and I've ended up dropping 40 pounds and taking better care of myself, because I want to be the type of woman he deserves. Yes, he's 5 inches shorter, but he is the hottest, most amazing man I've ever been with.
"Latinas are not very smart," now that is an intelligent opinion.
I'd argue shorter guys have a much harder time of it than fat chicks, being a somewhat fat chick who has dated some pretty fine looking guys. (To be fair, I am also a sex goddess, so there's that.) I've also dated guys much shorter than me (who were also sexy, just not so tall) - the shortest I've dated was seven inches shorter than me, and I've had long term relationships with guys close to or slightly shorter than me. Point is, these dudes were great guys. Interesting, funny, sexy, nicely hung - all the things a girl wants. But most of them had hardly dated at all and I found that tragic. I really wish my fellow ladies would take a second look at some of these guys, because I can't just date them all. I do think some shorter guys could stand to lose the chip on the shoulder though. I know a few guys who have totally overlooked ladies interested in them because they were too busy being all emo about the height issue. Do believe, some of us ARE into you.
R u joking? 5'10" is short? 5'10" is even a little above average for man in U.S. you must be a giant to consider 5'10" short
OK, this is a true story. I am 5'6". Women certainly are height prejudiced. In fact women are the most prejudiced people on the planet. They dismiss men on a single characteristic without knowing anything further. That is because the real function of a boyfriend for most women is to enhance their own prestige amongst their female peers. It is part of the pecking order of the female hierarchy.
Despite being short, I have always had very beautiful girlfriends and they were mostly my height and some gave me kids. I managed this by targeting the extremely attractive and being very different to the usual guy. I found if I could talk to a woman, I could get her interested. I guess this is game overcoming a limitation. The end of the relationship usually followed some member of the sisterhood making a mission of destroying it with the usual "What are you doing with him? You can do better". The negative opinion of the satellite females is the biggest threat to my happiness.
Well, my last girlfriend was 17 years younger and super hot - that lasted 13 years. Now I am 57 years old and I am living with a beautiful girl, a top university student, who is 19. Being short is certainly a negative, but it does not have to stop you. I am living proof: wherever I go I am always with the most beautiful girl in the room. I am used to it and I expect it because I deserve it.
But that would require employing logic. Logic and women? Are we talking about planet earth?
Agree 100%, but height might be the gauge that estimates penis size, of course it is not the case, for most famous porn star Ron Jermey with his 10 inch monster only stands 5'6" tall. My dad was my height, 6ft and endowed with an11 inch monstrosity ( famous in my town in Russia) yet two women divorced him, including my mother so what's the answer?
I'm 5 foot 6 never had a problem picking up girls, feels a bit odd when they are much taller than me though.
I think people look for excuses to fail, a top quality woman won't be bothered by height.
Maybe certain men have something lacking in their personality.
Haha lol the same thing happened to me mate. I'm 6ft 2in and I only once got turned down by a tall woman. I am well above average at mostly everything in my aspects of life (sports, wor etc). My game is top notch so I don't understand why I got turned down by this woman?
I am a guy that is only about 5'1", so if you think you struggle at 5'7" with women, try it losing another 1/2 foot. Oddly enough, I have only dated one woman that was my height The rest have all been taller than me. That was in High School and College. I was pretty athletic back then and would find girls here and there that were not concerned with my height. I have found as I have aged, it has actually become more difficult to meet women that are not concerned with height. Maybe its just that I don't meet as many woman now that I spend so much time working.
Recently, a secretary at work who is 5'7" told me that she would never date someone my height. When I told her that when I was in grad school I dated a 5'7" young lady also in grad school, she was amazed. She said that she only dates guys taller than her so she can feel more petite. It seems to me that its women that are insecure that will not date guys shorter than they are. Those women that are more secure seem to have less of an issue with height.
The question becomes, where can shorter men meet these confident women without moving to Latin America or Asia? I would not mind dating Latina or Asian women and have been to both Latin America and Asia. I just don't want to move. I have a good career andI work a lot and am not really into going to bars that much. I would like to hear from women where to meet those that are not hung up on height. I know they are out there because I dated them in the past. I don't think dating sites work because as soon as I list my height, I get passed over. I am confident, successful making 6 figures, do volunteer work with animals, enjoy traveling, scuba diving and riding my motorcycle. Any women reading these comments have any suggestions?
I really don't agree with your point of view, so let me give you my two cents. I, as a fairly tall (5.8), slim and attractive woman, I had 2 long term relationships with men who were my me exact same height. It didn't bother at all because both were amazing human beings. You people always put so much importance on looks. Instead of worrying of who may or may not find you attractive, focus on growing as a person, invest on your education, take some hobbies and be a decent human. Now, that's really hot. And, by the way, most women I know would go for a man who is taller than them ( not necesarilly above a certain limit) and I' m pretty sure not many will diss a handsome man who dresses well, works out and is under 5.9 for a tall unkept one.
A 5'10 man is tall not short in this country. Men who are over 6 foot plus do stand out as tall (although common) in 2016 England. The average man worldwide is definitely no MORE than 5'8 and I would say the average man in the Uk is more or less 5'9 on the nose. Men under average height are just as good as those who are tall.
Im 5”8 and i feel people few inches shorter or taller look around the same
"Asians are Asian." Curious what you meant. I've heard horror stories from dudes who dated asians. It it a personality think or culture? Or just not liking the asthetics?
"Asians are Asian." I thought that was a fantasy for many. Have you found the problems cultural, personality, or simple attraction?
Some of the things I've noticed about the short girls who emphasize height is that they wear tons of makeup, have wack bodies, are a bit kooky, and susceptible to surgical enhancements. They'll be the ones at 40 (after numerous yet worthless enhancements) using their 15 year old dogs and gay besties as sounding boards, complaining about how they wish they were gay men, as if being gay was some perfect existence.
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